January 23, 2012
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Comments on camera instead of smoke detectors
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Ken
I think you may be missing a bigger issue. NFPA says that if it looks like fire protection that it has to work like fire protection. Whoever is being recorded could come back with a lawsuit that they thought they were safe bu now feels endangered because there wasn't proper smoke detection. Just my $.02 worth.
Ed Spohr
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Check your state codes -
2010 California Fire Code section 901.4.4 Appearance of equipment.
Any device that has the physical appearance of life safety or fire protection equipment but that does not perform that life safety or fire protection functions shall be prohibited.
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Ken,
As a point of information, the New York State Fire Code prohibits the installation of non-working smoke detector cameras. "Section 901.4.4 Appearance of Equipment. Any device that has the physical appearance of life safety or fire protection equipment but that does not perform that life safety or fire protection function, shall be prohibited."
Ed Keshecki
Statewide Central Station
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Ken:
Installers should be aware that covert smoke detectors are illegal in New York City, I am not sure about Long Island.
Jeffrey Siegel
Director, Life Safety Division
American Security Systems Inc
Long Island City, NY
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In reference to Clorinda's question and your answer, Please reference the NYS Fire Code 901.4.4 No quick answer....you have to Look
Mike
CSS
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Question re fire alarm inspection scheduling
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Ken
We install fire alarms and let the customers know about the yearly FACP Fire Inspection. We first call our customers and try to schedule the inspection. If we don't hear back from a customer about the inspection I am going to send them a letter stating that it is required and so forth. Should I send the letter in regular mail or should I send it certified?
Thanks and have a great day,
Penny Kibler
Office Administrator
All Secure, Inc.
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Answer
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Unless the AHJ has some regulation regarding notification procedure, and I doubt there will be any such regulation, your inspection responsibility and notification efforts would be governed by your contract. The Standard Form Fire Alarm All in One includes the Inspection Service as one of the optional services. The contract does address scheduling and provides as follows:
"Inspection service includes testing of all components to insure proper working order. ALARM COMPANY will notify subscriber 3 days in advance of inspection date, and it is Subscriber's responsibility to reschedule or permit access. Testing at inspection insures only that components are in proper working order at time of inspection unless otherwise reported to Subscriber at time of inspection."
The Standard Fire All in One does not specify how notice is to be given and the only reference in the contract to communication, found in the Legal paragraph, is that mail is to be by First Class Pre paid postage delivered by the US Postal Service .... There is no requirement for certified mail and I rarely recommend that certified mail be used. Ordinary mail is presumed to be delivered and received. You can also use email or fax or telephone call which is documented in your records (i.e. date, time, person making call and person spoken to, summary of conversation).
If the AHJ requires you to notify AHJ if system is ( or is not) inspected in timely manner then make sure you provide that notification.
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Comment on Tennessee fire
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Hi Ken,
Ref: Tennessee Fire
If no one paid their $75, then we wouldn't be talking about a fire department that watched a trailer burn, because there would be no fire services for their rural area. If they didn't pay the $75, then they are not going to pay a $20,000 bill and insurance will likely NOT cover such a bill.
Danny D
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In the old days (1800's) you paid the insurance company for fire protection...and houses had firemarks. If you didn't have the company the fire company insured, they let it burn. Google firemarks, they are very collectable today.
Larry Heuvelman, CR, CGR, ROI
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Comment on selling batteries
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Hi Ken,
In regards to justin's question about selling batteries over the counter then letting their customers install them. Not a wise decision. First, how would the customer get into the panel? He shouldn't have a key. If he does, thats the biggest mistake you made installing the system.
Thats why its called a "security system". How secure is that?? YOU are the one that has to warrenty that panel. How can you warrenty it when someones "messing" around in it?
Second, talk about liability! if the customer "gets into the panel" and lets say, bumps a wire off that causes a trouble that now starts sending excessive traffic to central, then central wants to charge you for excessive traffic. Who's going too pay for that?
Third, what if a service person is down in the basement fixing something and sees the panel is open. All he has to do is jump a wire and bypass a zone then come back and rip the place off! The "big 2" companies usually leave all the program sheets and maunals in the panels. I've seen it every week I take one over!
Besides.....some panels you must power up and down with a specific sequence (like dsc) how would the customer know that? What if he hooks up the battery backwards and blows the main board? is he going to pay for that? he won't say he did it!
As you can see, you should never let your customer go into the panel. If he has a low battery, why wouldn't you want to go out and charge him for a nominal service call and make some money? While your there you can test the system, update the call list and see if they hooked up to an internet phone service which usually is wired wrong and you don't find out about untill a year later when they accidently tripped the system, then call you to see why the authorities didn't show.
Just my "2 cents" worth.
Greg
Walworth County Security Alarms